I Could've Had a V8!? Spare Me Your Supremacy and Shut Up

"Blake Noble" (no-bull) 04/02/2014 at 17:48 • Filed to: Rants, Car Enthusiasts

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Choice is the absurdly annoying and constantly nagging variable of human reality, the fuel for the chain of events we know as life. From sunrise to sunset, we're all constantly bombarded with requests and situations that require us to exercise our free will. Escape is futile.

Some decisions are so aggravating and painfully difficult to make they'll decompose your brain into a thick gray soup sloshing about in your skull. When faced with the choice between two different shades of off-white paint to coat your bedroom walls in, you'd have to go home and choke down Fioricet while you mull over color swatches until you threw up bile and wept tears of blood.

Thankfully, it isn't always that horrible. In fact, most choices are almost so pathetically easy to make, they're pretty much primal instinct. Given the option between scrubbing prison toilets for minimum wage or sitting at home taste-testing craft beer for a yearly salary that would equal China's entire GDP, it's hard to imagine anyone short of a total masochist would chose to clean Bubba's head for "seven something" an hour.

So given the role choice plays in our everyday lives, it shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone that the automotive marketplace is also choice driven. You can pick between a tiny car, a small car, a "just right-sized" car, and a big car. After you've selected which size cup you want your four-wheeled Big Gulp in, you can choose between these seven guaranteed-in-stock flavors: coupe, sedan, hatch, wagon (when a unicorn farts in Korea), crossover, sport-ute, pickup, and van.

Decided what you want? Okay, good. Now you have to figure out what engines are on the options sheet and choose between thriftiness or manliness. And while you'll most always be hooking your engine of choice up to some sort of lazy, benign automatic gearbox, occasionally someone will have the bright idea to give you the alternative of a manual one. Spoiler warning: you might have to choose there.

The dust hasn't settled yet, nope. After you've finally settled on what you want, you'll have one more decision to make — whether or not you can afford it. Ugh. Excuse me while I grab another Fioricet and a glass of water.

But don't misunderstand me. Having a world of choice when it comes to what you drive isn't a terrible thing. It's a great thing... except when it isn't. If you're Joe Schmoe, it means you can almost custom tailor your new mobile toaster, washing machine or fridge to better suit your point a-to-b lifestyle and live worry free. If you're an enthusiast on the other hand, the choices you've made concerning what you drive can sometimes make you hate getting out of bed in the morning.

Take me, for example. I drive a Dodge Charger. To Joe Schmoe, my silly oversized car with its vulgar, retro-macho patriotic styling, lack of chrome and big wheels alone most likely conveys to him the fact that I'm a petrolhead, a guy who likes and cares about cars. He doesn't know and doesn't care that it's the fleet-queen SE model that's as upmarket as a frozen Salisbury steak dinner. He doesn't know nor care that it "ain't got a Hem-mie." He recognizes the small aspirational image my car might have and that's where the buck stops.

What another enthusiast sees, however, can be a different story. Best case scenario, he'll see my car and might want to "talk Mopar" for a moment before he goes on about his way. Worst case scenario, he'll take one look at my car immediately know that, because of its lack of HID headlights, fog lights and tiny stereo, it's the base version. And because the base version only comes with a V6, he'll know that I didn't get the manly engine. Never mind the fact I was too broke to buy the eight-banger and forget the fact its still a big rear-drive car: that's an open invitation to him to give me grief about it.

"Why didn't you get the Hemi, dude? Why didn't you buy an SRT8? Man, you can't sit there and tell me you like cars if you didn't get the V8 and that big touch screen radio. I had one of these and I made sure I at least got the Hemi. Worth every penny and it'll beat that V6 of yours in a sneeze."

That's the first worse case scenario, actually. Second worse case scenario, he'll ignore the trim and engine and just point out that it's missing a third pedal. That's enough for him throw his supremacist's nose up and walk away.

Never mind the fact that I first learned how to drive on a woefully slow S10 pickup with a five-speed manual transmission and would do it again in a heartbeat. Never mind the fact Dodge never thought to offer the Charger with a row-your-own. If you buy a car, any car, with a slushbox, you're automatically disqualified as a "real enthusiast." You're plebeian, you're "casual." You should've just bought a beige Corolla.

Forgive me for being under the impression that the lone qualifier for being a car enthusiast was that, at the day's end when you've cleared your mind of criticism and cynicism, you generally love or at least accept and celebrate all cars good or bad. Not that what you drove had to reflect that down to the fasteners in the wheel arches.

Not all of us are like that, no, but there's still more than enough of these fedora-donning assholes (for those of you across the pond, substitute the fedora for an anorak) among our ranks, clouding up the pool water. Who let these clowns into the club? And who let them decide car-shaming was cool?

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crowmolly > Blake Noble 04/02/2014 at 17:53

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You really want to mess with him? Remind him that you haven't been able to get a real Hemi from the factory since 1971. You just didn't buy "the V8 with the accompanying marketing gimmick" in this case.

Textured Soy Protein > Blake Noble 04/02/2014 at 17:55

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I'm the exact opposite. Every car I've bought has been the top trim. Integra GSR, Miata 10th Anniversary Edition, Mazdaspeed 6, 135is (well this was after the 1M so it was the top trim available). Even my winter beater Grand Cherokee is a Limited V8.

It's like one of my friends said when I was telling him about my new-at-the-time MS6: "you never get the regular version."

That said, generally I don't insult people's cars. Because they like what they like. Unless they try to say some stupid shit that's just stupid.

lone_liberal > Blake Noble 04/02/2014 at 17:59

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If a guy looks down on you like that they really don't know anything about cars. The vast majority of Mustangs and Camaros sold have always been the 6 cylinder cars for the reasons that you state. Some buyers, and specifically young buyers, can't afford the car, insurance and/or gas of the big engine. It's not a mark of shame. It's the mark of getting an interesting car on the budget that you have.

feather-throttle-not-hair > Blake Noble 04/02/2014 at 18:03

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I think on principal it's a pretty bad idea to shame people over their cars.

I would never buy the car you bought, but my life also involves a completely different set of circumstances than yours. This obvious difference has led us to purchase different cars.

It seems like it would be actually quite simple to understand, but some people really struggle with it.

feather-throttle-not-hair > Textured Soy Protein 04/02/2014 at 18:05

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For me, i feel like I always want to have the best engine available. All that luxury stuff i could care less about. But most powerful engine is a must most of the time. And M/T. A/T on a car that came with a M/T also is a deal breaker.

Just my preference.

Also, MS6s are awesome. Love those.

crowmolly > lone_liberal 04/02/2014 at 18:06

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It's the volume sales of those six bangers that allows the special editions to even be feasible in some cases. Has been like that for years.

RazoE > Blake Noble 04/02/2014 at 18:09

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Think of it as 2 (paternal) twin sisters. You chose the ugly one instead of the pretty one.

That said, transmission is more important to me than engine.

StoneCold > Textured Soy Protein 04/02/2014 at 18:25

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"Even my winter beater Grand Cherokee is a Limited V8."

Shoulda gotten the Overland

/kidding

LuczOr > Blake Noble 04/02/2014 at 18:26

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That's fine and all, but given the choice, you would take the manual, V8 car if money were no object, am I right?

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > RazoE 04/02/2014 at 18:30

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*Fraternal*, I think you mean. Not twin sisters on your father's side, because nobody wants intergenerational twin-based incest threesomes with older women. Except Japan.

McLarry > Blake Noble 04/02/2014 at 18:31

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It seems to me there's something of a 'buzzfeed' conformist element emerging out of our already-materialist culture... It's bad enough just having X judging Y by whether Y's car is as good as X's, but now we have "10 signs you're totally an automotive enthusiast!" and if you don't check all 10 boxes, each one you miss is a reason to demean you and your choices. I'll admit to having fallen into the '3-pedal superiority complex' but I try hard not to because I generally quickly realize I just put down my friend's priorities for not being the same as mine, and unless they answer with "screw you, I didn't want that crap" there's nothing you need to convince them of. You bought what you did for a reason, and I think the better question is "why this one?" rather than "why not that one?"

BlazinAce - Doctor of Internal Combustion > Blake Noble 04/02/2014 at 18:34

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Is it just me, or that sounds awfully like the FP and its manual-brown-turbo-diesel wagon elitist ways? Because it totally does. Me, I'm glad I was born without the ability to give fucks to what other people think. What I do is my business and nobody else's, so why care, amirite?

Textured Soy Protein > StoneCold 04/02/2014 at 18:39

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Haha it's a '99 and the Overland didn't come out til like '02 so technically it was the top trim the year it was made. ;)

The Compromiser > Blake Noble 04/02/2014 at 18:46

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Oddly my 1st Vehicle was a manual S10. And I currently drive a V6 CHARGER. ARE YOU ME???

I picked the 6. Insurance and my foot made the choice.

StoneCold > Textured Soy Protein 04/02/2014 at 18:46

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Just givin' you a hard time

Blake Noble > LuczOr 04/02/2014 at 18:49

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But of course. There would be a Stone White six-speed Challenger R/T in my driveway right now if I could at least make the payments.

Blake Noble > feather-throttle-not-hair 04/02/2014 at 19:12

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Precisely.

What makes car culture so vibrant is that everyone owns something different, not to mention that each and every enthusiast comes from a different walk of life. But I'm not trying to preach a message of tolerance. I think it's good we argue about which car was the greatest of all time. I think it's more than okay to make fun of the bad cars automakers have built over the years and complain when they aren't building what we want. That's all a part of celebrating and discussing the industry. But the one thing you should never do is exclude someone from the club just because you think their car doesn't qualify them. That's as fucking stupid as it is wrong.

Blake Noble > The Compromiser 04/02/2014 at 19:32

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o_O

Was your S10 Indigo Blue Metallic?

Blake Noble > lone_liberal 04/02/2014 at 19:40

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It's not a mark of shame. It's the mark of getting an interesting car on the budget that you have.

Excellently said.

The Compromiser > Blake Noble 04/02/2014 at 19:46

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No. BACK EXTENDED cab. 4.3 '96 NewfiE Sports Car.

Blake Noble > RazoE 04/02/2014 at 19:48

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Think of it as 2 (paternal) twin sisters. You chose the ugly one instead of the pretty one.

Let's say I parked two identical looking Chargers next to one another. There's no badging denoting which car is in what trim and no difference in options. One car is the 3.6L V6 and the other the 5.7L Hemi, but I'm not telling you which car has what motor and you certainly can't look under the hood to find out. What you're telling me then is the V6 car is uglier than the V8 car even though you can't tell which car has the bigger engine.

Vitriol aside, I get the analogy you were going for. It's more like I had the choice between two fraternal twin sisters, but chose the one with smaller tits. And I'm okay with that. Sometimes small tits are just as nice as tig ol' bitties. :)

That said, transmission is more important to me than engine.

And owning one over the other doesn't make you any more of an enthusiast.

dr861 > Blake Noble 04/02/2014 at 21:34

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The hp numbers on the base dodge v6's is pretty good comparable to a honda or toyota, and with those brands you'd have to get the best version and still not have as much power as the base charger. And at least your car looks good. Granted guys like me will scoff at it shamelessly, but I bet the Hemi guys hear the same thing, "why not the SRT8?" or the audi r8 "why not the v10?" My apologies for all of us. But honestly, we understand, or at least I do. You get a full sedan, a big sedan, a trunk, and some pep. You are more reasonable than me. There are used car people and new car people, neither one is right, but both think we are. I would never buy a brand new charger v6 when I could buy a few year old CTS V or E63 or M5, yet I'm sure you have to good sense to realize I will spend far more in BS mechanical issues than you will with your spankin' new vehicle.

The one thing I absolutely cannot abide are v6 mustangs, unless it's like a 1964 1/2 or 1965, because your a collector or something. But even those suck. What kind of person buys a 98 mustang with a v6? Who are you and what do you stand for? Even tuned v6 mustang's make me angry, and they sound bad. I'd take a box body chevy caprice over ANY v6 mustang.

RazoE > Blake Noble 04/03/2014 at 09:56

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No, I can definitely tell the difference between a V6 and a V8 Charger. Same with Camaros and of course, Mustangs. Maybe "ugly" is the wrong word, should have gone with "less attractive."

RazoE > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 04/03/2014 at 09:57

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hahah, yeah that's what I meant.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > Blake Noble 04/09/2014 at 14:52

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It's not how fast you go, it's how you go fast.

I'd take doing constant 120MPH flat out in a Mercedes B180CDI (Vmax) on the Autobahn, over a 911 Turbo S which I could only do 170+ for very short times, and not hit Vmax. (Hint: I did exactly that in a B180)

Besides, its far more fun to drive a slower car (say, a BRZ) than a faster car (say, a C7 Vette), assuming that you are able to get closer to the limits of the slower car.

PeteRR > Blake Noble 04/09/2014 at 18:45

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I've had people ask me why I opted for the V-6 version of the Challenger. I tell them I already own a muscle car and didn't need two of them.

SirUno > crowmolly 04/09/2014 at 19:10

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I casually remind folks of this every now and then, and all I get in return is a strange blank stare akin to ye olde "Deer in the headlights". Good times.

yurikaze > Blake Noble 04/09/2014 at 19:13

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The fact my $1600 Mustang GT convertible has a V8 is the only thing it has going for it. Don't take that away from me.

lasdla > Blake Noble 04/09/2014 at 19:34

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Ever since I had my 335i ive been reminded my mustang gt owners atleast 50times that "i couldve had a v8 for 15k cheaper"

Damnit, i dont want your shitty V8 Mustang, take your V8 and shove it.

Stradale > Blake Noble 04/09/2014 at 19:38

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I know what you mean. I hate it when guys in Ferrari's talk shit about my Eclipse.

zombiEinstein > Blake Noble 04/09/2014 at 20:34

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Last year I bought a 2013 Challenger R/T with the 6 speed manual. The main reason I bought the R/T was because of the manual. The V8 was an added bonus. I have just never owned an automatic and couldn't start now. I had to pull extra money out of savings to cover the difference in cost between the SXT and the R/T.

TheSpin > Blake Noble 04/09/2014 at 20:48

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Elitist = narrow minded.

People who limit their own lives are mind blowing. Try new stuff. Realize that your favorites are not the only things with value. Never assume someone that disagrees with you is an idiot.

Obviously I am speaking in generalities when I say "you."

Man, I love cars. Almost all cars. I like people people that like cars. Almost all people who like cars. I have met guys with HHRs and PT Cruisers that are insanely great people. I don't know if they realize a lot of people at Cars & Coffee think they are silly...or maybe they do and still show up to hang out...because they are good people. Car people.

STANDARD6SPEED > Textured Soy Protein 04/09/2014 at 21:06

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I'm the exact same way. If I can't afford the top-trim/spec of a car, I'll buy a less expensive car so that I can have the top-spec of that.

I won't approach people just to car shame them, but if I'm asked, I'm not going to lie to them about what I think of their car ;) And that goes with anything about the car, not just trim choice

spanfucker retire bitch > Blake Noble 04/09/2014 at 21:19

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Second worse case scenario, he'll ignore the trim and engine and just point out that it's missing a third pedal. That's enough for him throw his supremacist's nose up and walk away.

These people are literally worse than Hitler.

DayWooTang > Blake Noble 04/09/2014 at 22:02

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It took you seven paragraphs to get to the point.

SirRaoulDuke > Blake Noble 04/09/2014 at 22:05

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I am of the mind I would rather purchase a pre-owned performance model than a new lower-level model if cost is the main consideration. To each their own though; and if you are young and it is for insurance, I totally understand, I was there once too.

Howie > crowmolly 04/10/2014 at 00:00

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Tru'dat, but I don't think the current "hemi" is all that bad, its more Ford "cresent" chamber than old school hemi but you get a nice compact chamber, canted valves (the real reason those hemis worked) and some added quench which makes it IMO a much better engine with the exception of not having an honest 7 liters from the factory.

SukhoiRomantic > Blake Noble 04/10/2014 at 00:00

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SE is stunningly good looking for a base model. Just had a look at Dodges website and to get the V8 you need to spend another 4 grand plus I'm assuming in the US you would have a gas guzzler tax, higher insurance for the V8, basically lots of rational decisions around cost. I'm with you on this one. Not every enthusiast wants to buy a used car nor can necessarily afford or is willing to pay more for the halo model

94GTratracer > McLarry 04/10/2014 at 00:04

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So yes, and I think that the reason what you say is true is that every car has a story. I have some good stories about a Corolla I owned that had rotten shocks and handled like a land speeder on Tatooine, for example, but I'm glad I've moved on. I also can't help it, I'm a snob. If somebody's got a donk or a JDM hella-stanced car, I hope they at least have a sense of humor.

mr2gud2u > Blake Noble 04/10/2014 at 00:38

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Great post. Sometimes I do catch myself judging.

kitchenaire > Blake Noble 04/10/2014 at 01:34

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What about shaming someone who bought a 2013 Mustang V6? The Mustang just isn't a particularly good car, and I say that as someone who is seriously considering a 2013 or a 2015 GT as my next car. The Mustang is ALL about the V8. Nothing to do with speed though necessarily, as the current V6 is probably faster than every Mustang ever til 2005. More just the feel of the car is totally lost with the V6 imho (I've never driven a V6 Mustang though). Anyway, for me personally V6 Stangs are primarily about posing, but maybe I just need to get over myself and realize that all of us pose and there's nothing necessarily wrong with that

kitchenaire > DayWooTang 04/10/2014 at 01:35

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And the reason you have to be such a douche is...?

kitchenaire > Stradale 04/10/2014 at 01:36

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you win the internets sir

kitchenaire > lasdla 04/10/2014 at 01:37

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The V8 Mustang is an awesomely charismatic car to drive though. I'd recommend taking a test drive someday :)

DayWooTang > kitchenaire 04/10/2014 at 01:49

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Was I? Sorry about that.

Kookanoodles > Blake Noble 04/10/2014 at 03:33

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"Why didn't you get the Hemi, dude? Why didn't you buy an SRT8? Man, you can't sit there and tell me you like cars if you didn't get the V8 and that big touch screen radio. I had one of these and I made sure I at least got the Hemi. Worth every penny and it'll beat that V6 of yours in a sneeze."

Read all of that in that Regular Car Reviews voice.

CarlitoBenito > RazoE 04/10/2014 at 08:10

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Just stop talking. The only difference is the R/T badge. You can get a SXT Plus V6 and it will look like a base R/T. Add the performance pack and I'll bet you'd have trouble telling the difference between it and a Hemi R/T with performance pack.

#hatersgonhate

Illegal Machine > Blake Noble 04/10/2014 at 08:16

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I've had two SRT-8's. It's worth it. FYI.

Andy Stearman > Blake Noble 04/10/2014 at 08:24

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Well said. As a former V6 Mustang owner and current 13 Charger R/T owner, I still get grief. "Why didn't you get the SRT8?" "Uhhhh, MPGs and I drive this thing every damn day." Lack of the "right" engine/car by "enthusiast" standards don't make you less of an enthusiast. I'm probably guilty at some point of this, but it is good for an enthusiast to read this and understand that we are all in the same hobby.

+1 for American RWD awesomeness BTW!

crowmolly > Howie 04/10/2014 at 09:12

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It is certainly splitting hairs and the modern "hemi" is a great engine. It's just a way to pop the bubble of somebody who might be lording their "hemi" over you. It's not really a hemi without a hemispherical chamber. :D

I think spark plug placement was another reason for out-of-the-ordinary 70's performance.

drdude > Blake Noble 04/10/2014 at 09:44

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Dude, just pull out a LS v8 with a manual behind it and swap it in your car. BAM.. V8, Manual.. and you get to piss off everyone as its not even a Mopar anymore. lol..

ChargerGirlMass > Blake Noble 04/10/2014 at 09:53

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I have both an SRT Charger and a 6 cylinder Challenger. Yes the SRT is fast and has a touch screen. But that doesn't mean that I can't have fun with the Challenger. The 6 cylinder challenger is more fun to drive at normal highway speeds. With a heavily modified custom exhaust and the paddle shifters I can get the 6 cylinder to make that classic italian sports car sound, which to me is very pleasing. Even though it also has a touch screen, I roll down the windows and open the sun roof just to hear that sound. The SRT on the other hand just wants to go fast not just once in a while, but all the time, which is fine for ripping through highway traffic or long stretches of road.

mfc133 > RazoE 04/10/2014 at 10:16

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Automakers have always made the base models look more "pedestrain" intentionally. Smaller wheels, less aggressive fascia, lack of fog ligts, single rather than dual exhaust tips, etc. But there's nothing wrong with buying the base model and bolting on the specific premium bits that you prefer.

Ian McDowell > crowmolly 04/10/2014 at 11:16

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please do, because we have moved on to better things. Mopar people constantly go on about their hemi engines like no other car has used them. The think of big american v8s. Nevermind the hemi inline 6 XK engine that jaguar used for years and won with at lemans.

Pinkslip > Blake Noble 04/10/2014 at 18:55

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That's funny- You just described my friend's car exactly. And yet I still found myself asking him "Why didn't you get the SRT8?" It's all relative and everyone has a different perspective and situation. But I never question his status as a car guy, just because I would have bought a different trim/model/brand. I drove a Miata in college, so I am quite familiar with people questioning all sorts of things about me based on the car I drive.

Blake Noble > DayWooTang 04/11/2014 at 01:11

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Sorry. A literary influence was showing there.

Actually, I'm not sorry. But still.

lasdla > kitchenaire 04/11/2014 at 16:19

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I've driven 4 different kinds of GT's (2013 Premium, 2013 base, 2012, and a 2010). All were massive pieces of shit, but it isn't a car targeted to car enthusiasts as Billy Bob Joe looking for a cool looking first car. Very poor steering feedback, body roll everywhere, shit interior, shit looks, terrible handling, and you can feel the weight everywhere. Not to mention I've ever seen a Mustang GT owner over the age of 17. Not that's a bad thing, I'm not any older myself.

kitchenaire > lasdla 04/12/2014 at 01:20

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Where do you live? I live in Toronto, Canada, and 95% of Mustang GT owners are in their mid 30s at least. Perhaps their cheaper initial purchase price, lower gas prices, and possibly lower insurance means teenagers can afford them. What spec is your 335i? Nice car, shame the new one apparently doesn't drive as well as yours.

lasdla > kitchenaire 04/12/2014 at 12:33

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I live in Texas, so most of what you said were true. My above response may have been a bit harsh. I'm sure they're are people out there who do like them, but I do not at all. My 335i is a 2011 (last year of e9x)

boobytrapsandtreasure > Blake Noble 06/26/2014 at 08:25

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Car ownership for a vast majority of enthusiasts comes down to what you can fit into your budget. Fuel, insurance, maintenance, payments add up quickly. I may draw some fire for saying so but when comparing the new Mustang Boss 302 vs. the V6 I would choose the V6. It has 300 hp, 280 ftlbs of torque, goes 0-60 in 5.6 seconds, gets 29 mpg, the maintenance costs will be less and the insurance company won't try to have their way with my wallet. And if you keep it long enough the do-it-yourself costs should be manageable because of the ubiquity of the parts. It is true you will not have the rumble-grumble of the V8 but that aside the V6 with a mild suspension and brake upgrade would be a fun car to have as a DD.

thebigbossyboss > crowmolly 06/26/2014 at 09:32

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True say, true say.

thebigbossyboss > kitchenaire 06/26/2014 at 09:34

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Dude. I want a land yacht. Talk about all show and no go. My goal is to cruise down main street at 15 mph.

?i

kitchenaire > thebigbossyboss 06/26/2014 at 11:45

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uhhhhh okay? Yeah that car looks awesome